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Thieves Like Us (1974)
Thieves Like Us (1974) poster

Thieves Like Us (1974)

Crime, Drama, Romance • 2h 3m

Director: Robert Altman

Cast: Keith Carradine, Shelley Duvall, John Schuck, Bert Remsen, Louise Fletcher, Ann Latham, Tom Skerritt, Al Scott, John Roper, Mary Waits, Rodney Lee, Arch Hall Sr., Joan Tewkesbury, Eleanor Matthews, Pam Warner, Suzanne Majure, Walter Cooper, Lloyd Jones, Matthew R. Altman, Sim Dulaney

Best video release

Video notes:

Cinematrographe's HDR grading is overcooked, which is a known VinSyn tendency. Additionally, their booklet mis-credits the encode to FiM.

YMMV, but for some, the included BD encoded by Marcus Johnson—ironically may make for a more pleasing experience.

Updated yesterday


UHD tiers

Excellent
Vinegar Syndrome Cinématographe

About the film

Three criminals escape from prison and embark on a robbery spree across USA. Along the way, one of them falls in love while they plan a final heist before going their separate ways.

More from Robert Altman

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Director: Robert Altman

Sources: Blu-ray.com (opens in a new tab)

Video Notes:

Cinematographe is an FiM encode

Director: Robert Altman

Best Video:

Paramount Blu-ray

Sources: Criterion Forum (opens in a new tab)

Upcoming Release:

Criterion 4K Blu-ray scheduled for Dec 2026 release

Director: Robert Altman

4K · Solid
Best English-Friendly:

Paramount 4K Blu-ray

Sources: YouTube (opens in a new tab) · mega.nz (opens in a new tab)

Best Audio:

Paramount Blu-ray

Audio Notes:

Popeye was mixed for a failed Vistasonic system with 4 discrete tracks (L/C/R/S). That mix has never been released on home video in its original form.

The older 5.1 track appearing on older DVD/BD releases sounds excellent. It appears to be a slight upmix of the original mix, only splitting the surrounds and adding LFE. It sounds close to the old analog LaserDisc, which is likely the original mix in a matrixed form.

The 5.1 included on the UHD is a new remix which significantly differs from previous tracks. There are new foley effects all over the place. Music is jarringly spliced in from different sources. Unlike the old 5.1 which had clearly discrete surrounds, the channels surrounds overlap somewhat with the fronts here.

Details on the new mix from Paramount's former head of restoration: https://youtu.be/P-AmjqViJyE?t=788

The 2.0 tracks on all DVDs/BDs are just downmixes of their respective 5.1 mixes.

Samples

Director: Robert Altman

4K · Excellent

Director: Robert Altman

Best Video:

Fox Blu-ray

Director: Robert Altman

Video format: 1080p Blu-ray

Best Video:

Kino Lorber

Video Notes:

Kino Lorber has new 4k resto, not sure about color grading

Best Audio:

?

Director: Robert Altman

Director: Robert Altman

Best Video:

Arrow Blu-ray

Sources: Criterion Forum (opens in a new tab)

Video Notes:

Arrow newer master, but different (better?) colours than Criterion Blu-ray

Best Audio:

Arrow Blu-ray with EQ adjusted or Criterion DVD

Director: Robert Altman

Director: Robert Altman

More from Vinegar Syndrome

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Director: Jonathan Demme

Video format: UHD Blu-ray

Sources: vitalpassenger.com (opens in a new tab)

Video Notes:

FiM are mistakenly credited, one of the four known instances of this for a Cinématographe title (the other three being Thieves Like Us, Who Killed Teddy Bear?, and The Gambler). 4K encode was done by Vital Passenger.  https://vitalpassenger.com/our-work

Director: Jerry Schatzberg

Director: Lam Nai-choi

Best Video:

88 Films UK or Vinegar Syndrome US Blu-ray (preference)

Video Notes:

Different color gradings, 88 Films disc is encoded by FiM but Vinegar Syndrome encode (by Marcus Johnson) is more than robust

Audio Notes:

Vinegar Syndrome potentially has better audio than 88 Films, due to VinSyn possibly having EQ'd the audio mix after Fortune Star scanned the track in a way that makes it sound too hot, whereas 88 left it alone without addressing that issue. However, no direct comparisons exist

Director: Hal Needham

4K · Excellent

Director: Trey Parker

Best Video:

UK Refuse Films or US Vinegar Syndrome Blu-ray

Video Notes:

Both releases have two presentations: sourced from the original Betacam master tapes, and another that uses a filmout of the tapes.

Director: Simon Wincer

Director: Keenen Ivory Wayans

4K · Solid
Best Video & Audio:

Vinegar Syndrome 4K Blu-ray

Director: William Friedkin

4K · Excellent

Director: Joe Dante

4K · Excellent

Director: Abel Ferrara

Video format: UHD Blu-ray

Upcoming Release:

Vinegar Syndrome 4K Blu-ray in July

More Crime on Blu-ray

Director: Jonathan Demme

4K · Excellent
Best Video:

Arrow 4K Blu-ray

Sources: Criterion Forum (opens in a new tab)

Best Audio:

1991 Orion LaserDisc vs 2024 Arrow 4K Blu-ray vs Criterion

Audio Notes:

Three masterings of the original Dolby Stereo SR mix exist: the original Orion video releases, the Criterion (which is from their LD) and the Arrow. All three are excellent with slight mastering differences between them. The original Orion still is probably the one with the most fidelity, the Criterion is the cleanest with a kind of warm feel to it and the Arrow has a bit of both aspects. The Arrow mastering has a tiny almost imperceptible bit of audio bleeding into the surround that isn't on the Criterion. Each has their own pluses and minuses but you can't go wrong with any of them. Whatever you do though: DO NOT WATCH WITH THE 5.1 REMIX. It is another MGM botch job that fundamentally alters the impact of many scenes. It is vastly inferior to the original mix in every way.

Additional Info:

Criterion Blu-ray has exclusive extras, Arrow UHD has the most extras of any release

Director: Wong Kar-Wai

Video format: 1080p Blu-ray

4K · Disappointing
Best English-Friendly:

2010 US Kino Lorber or 2012 UK Artificial Eye

Sources: slow.pics (opens in a new tab)

Best Video:

2017 JP Kadokawa Blu-ray

Video Notes:

2017 JP Kadokawa Blu-ray has the best encoding out of all the older discs.


Kino Lorber and Artificial Eye Blu-ray use the same master, between the two the PQ on Kino's release is slightly better, but the difference is negligible. However, Artificial Eye also includes the 2.0 stereo mix in addition to the 5.1 mix, while Kino only includes 5.1 mix.

The 4K restoration (Criterion, 4K etc) are cropped to 2.35:1, have revisionistic colour grading and other changes.

Caps: old master, old master vs 4K restoration

Wong Kar-Wai on the framing:

With Fallen Angels, I have changed the format to cinemascope, because it was originally what I had intended to release the film in. When we were cutting the film, we accidentally turned the Steenbeck on anamorphic instead of standard. I felt that the film looked much more interesting because it enhanced the distance of the characters on top of the extreme wide angle that we shot on. Back then, it was impossible to shoot a film in standard and release it in anamorphic. With this restoration, we have successfully fulfilled this wish.

Director: Roy Del Ruth

Video Notes:

4K restoration of the original 3D left eye and right eye camera negatives

Director: John Woo

4K · Excellent

Sources: Criterion Forum (opens in a new tab) · Blu-ray.com (opens in a new tab)

Upcoming Release:

Plaion Germany 4K Blu-ray

Video Notes:

Arrow has a different grade and a better encode than the Shout! Factory, though the difference in either is not major. Imprint release, which leaves Shout! Factory's master and subtitles as is, is encoded by FiM. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php?p=24473097&postcount=56

Best Audio:

Original mix: Shout! Factory 4K Blu-ray

Alternate mix: Scanbox Nordic PAL DVD

Surround remix: HK Video France 4K Blu-ray (5.0)

Audio Notes:

Original mix: Shout! Factory 4K Blu-ray (similar to Criterion LaserDisc, but less distorted)

Alternate mix: Scanbox Nordic PAL DVD

Surround remix: HK Video France 4K Blu-ray (5.0)

Arrow used the alternate mix, but with extra filtering and lowered dynamic range. The alternate mix has much better fidelity.

Imprint presumably used the Shout! Factory original mix and left it as is, though no official confirmation.

Additional Info:

Arrow has a much better translation.

Arrow LE has the Taiwan Extended Cut which will not be present on the standard edition. However, Imprint is FiM and has its own archival extras not present on the Arrow.

Director: Richard Brooks

Video Notes:

4K restoration from Original Camera Negative

Director: William Dieterle

Video Notes:

4K restoration from Original Camera Negative

Director: Stanley Kubrick

4K · Solid
Best Video & Audio:

Imprint 4K Blu-ray

Sources: Criterion Forum (opens in a new tab)

Video Notes:

The 4K discs in both Criterion and Imprint sets are FiM encodes, but low-passed, Imprint minimally less so. Unfortunately, unlike with The Killing, Kino does not hold up at all, the grain is much rougher and the compression visibly struggles making for a much less pleasant watch, even if select stills look better.

Audio Notes:

All discs use the same source transfer. Criterion cleaned up some hums and hiss, but lost a little bit of high-end detail. Unlike The Killing, the difference's relatively mino.

Additional Info:

The Criterion Complete Kubrick and Imprint 1953-1957 sets include remastered BDs. All standalone releases are from an earlier master.
Arrow UK Blu-ray has an exclusive isolated score & effects track. Kino Lorber and Imprint have an exclusive commentary each.

Director: Stanley Kubrick

4K · Excellent

Sources: Criterion Forum (opens in a new tab) · slow.pics (opens in a new tab)

Video Notes:

The 4K discs in both Criterion and Imprint sets are FiM encodes, but low-passed. The compression is better, but some of the grain is lost. Difference is pronounced in screen caps, but not likely to be noticed during playback, without a reference to compare it to. Comparisons

Best Audio:

Anything other than Criterion 4K/Blu-ray

Audio Notes:

All discs use the same source transfer. It's not of the highest quality, and it includes some slight distortion, looping, clicks, pops, and hum. Criterion cleaned it up for their release, but unfortunately also lost a lot of fidelity in the process.

MGM NTSC DVD doesn't seem to have some of the more prominent distortion and has slightly different EQ but is otherwise the same.

Additional Info:

The Criterion Complete Kubrick and Imprint 1953-1957 sets include remastered BDs. All standalone releases are from an earlier master.
Arrow UK Blu-ray has an exclusive isolated score & effects track. Kino Lorber and Imprint have an exclusive commentary each.

Director: Karel Reisz

4K · Solid

Sources: Blu-ray.com (opens in a new tab)

Video Notes:

Cinematographe is mis-credited to be an FiM encode. It isn't. Neither the encode nor the color grading are entirely satisfactory.

Director: Frank Darabont

4K · Solid
Best Video:

2021 WB 4K Blu-ray

Sources: Blu-ray.com (opens in a new tab)

Best Audio:

2008 US Blu-ray 5.1

Audio Notes:

(the 2021 4K's 5.1 was flawed, with unnecessary bad tweaking)

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